Just 1% of people are responsible for half of all toxic emissions from flying.
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Everyone in these comments so far is misrepresenting the information here and arguing off of an incorrect assumption.
This is NOT saying that the 1% wealthiest people are responsible for half of these emissions. This is saying that 1% of travellers are responsible for half these emissions because those travelers travel so frequently. It has nothing to do with their wealth or using private jets. It’s about how much they’re flying.
Source: From the study linked in the petition: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0959378020307779
“1% of world population emits 50% of CO2 from commercial aviation.” Not private jets. Commercial aviation.
“Data also supports that a minor share of air travelers is responsible for a large share of warming: The percentile of the most frequent fliers – at most 1% of the world population - likely accounts for more than half of the total emissions from passenger air travel.”
“Everyone in these comments doesn’t understand”
You’ve been arguing against me that commercial flights aren’t an issue because I’ve pointed out the same fucking thing 7h before you!
I never said that. I said that they’re not as big of an issue as cars. You’re lying. If you’re going to focus your efforts, as I’ve stated now multiple times, it would be more impactful to tell people to drive less, not more. Airline travel is more efficient than driving.
That’s probably the stupidest statement I’ve read today
Well then, I’m sorry that you have to live life as an idiot. That must be tough.
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“A new report from the University of Michigan’s Transportation Research Institute shows that flying has become 74% more efficient per passenger since 1970 while driving gained only 17% efficiency per passenger. In fact, the average plane trip has been more fuel efficient than the average car trip since as far back as 2000, according to their calculations.”
http://websites.umich.edu/~umtriswt/PDF/UMTRI-2014-2_Abstract_English.pdf
“The main findings are that to make driving less energy intensive than flying, the fuel economy of the entire fleet of light-duty vehicles would have to improve from the current 21.5 mpg to at least 33.8 mpg, or vehicle load would have to increase from the current 1.38 persons to at least 2.3 persons.”
https://yaleclimateconnections.org/2015/09/evolving-climate-math-of-flying-vs-driving/
When used for passengers and for the same purpose, no they’re not. They only are if they’re used for the same distance and the car has one passenger and the plane is full, but I’m sure even you realise how disingenuous that comparison is.
Again, not true. The statements are based on current averages of 80% occupancy in a plane and 1.3 passengers per trip. That means that, on average, most planes are close to full occupancy while most car rides are 1 passenger rides. It’s not disingenuous at all.
If you’re only going to focus on the small percent of car rides with 3+ people, then you’re already moving the goalposts from the initial claims.
I’m focusing on travels for the same fucking purpose because my point from the beginning has been that we would be better off if people used their car to go on vacation instead because they would use less gas because they wouldn’t go as far AND because cars are more efficient when there’s more than one passenger in them, you keep using numbers that don’t make sense because you compare average occupancy for long distance travel by plane to occupancy for mixed distance travel by car.
No fucking shit most of the times car travel there’s only one person inside, most of the times they don’t travel long distances for vacations! When they do their occupancy tends to be higher because the majority of people don’t go on long distance vacation alone!
Ban air travel is fucking stupid
Banning it for non essential needs isn’t when we’re facing a climate crisis that will displace millions (if not billions in the long run).
Yes, as I said, you’re moving the goal posts! The initial point that was being discussed was whether or not planes have higher emissions that cars because planes are less efficient than cars and that’s not true. You’re arguing a hypothetical that puts the car in an ideal situation while simultaneously putting planes in the worst situation. You suggested banning the majority of commercial flights when that won’t even make as big of an impact. Why not ban the majority of cars since they have a far greater cumulative impact than planes? If we’re going for completely unreasonable suggestions that only affect single-digit percentages of the problem, why not ban boats too?
my point from the beginning has been that we would be better off if people used their car to go on vacation instead because they would use less gas because they wouldn’t go as far
And my point was that this is an unreasonable ask since it would limit where people can travel while not actually moving the needle in any substantive, meaningful way.
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You could also just tax those things at rates the super-rich will actually feel in their bank accounts.
Progressive tax based on income, jet type and frequency.
Or just a rate sufficient to remove and sequester 2x the amount.
Or require them to use 100% sustainable fuel to accelerate the development of such fuels.
Carbon sequestration is not possible right now or even for the foreseeable future.
Forcing jets to use renewable resources is a good one be should aim to ban private short and medium haul flights in general.
Are trees not sufficient for carbon sequestration?
In order to actually sequester carbon from trees you then need to cut them down and use or burry the lumber in a place where it will rest for the rest of time. Besides we would need vastly more space, water, and firefighting to even approach real offsets. Trees are nice for shade and some ecosystems but they don’t really have anything to do with climate change beyond burning up faster.
Think of the carbon life cycle.
There’s hydrocarbons underground that have been there for millions of years. Used to be in the air, but now it’s not.
Now it’s burned as jet fuel (releasing that cow back into the air)
If trees pull that co2 info their wood, what happens to that wood in 10,000 years? It’s going to be in the atmosphere again (bacteria and fungi break down dead wood)
So the only way to do it, using trees, would be to burry them after maturation and make sure they don’t rot. And you’d need to do this to capture the gigs tonnes of co2 that is released (that’s a lot of trees…and a lot of digging…)
Not possible? It’s happening in various places already
Can you provide examples?
I have seen big contraptions that promise it but aren’t actually doing it.
If it were up to me we’d blanket ban anything that only the ultra rich can afford and force them to put the funds into improving public services. If they want private flights, great, but they also have to offer them at an affordable price to the average person. Basically, “if you didn’t bring enough for the whole class, you can’t eat it,” but for rich people.
You’ve got it exactly backwards. The problem isn’t that the rich buy too much. The problem is that they don’t buy enough. They lend and invest and leverage and otherwise use their money to create debts owed to them.
The cars they buy each pay autoworker wages. The shares they buy in that car company creates an obligation on the company to pay them dividends.
We should be doing everything we can to increase their costs and decrease returns on excessive investments, while removing impediments on them buying services and manufactured products.
So encourage them to fly more?
Economically, yes. Ecologically, no.
If they want private flights, great, but they also have to offer them at an affordable price to the average person.
Individual motorized transport for the masses, but in the skies? This would ultimately doom our ecosphere. Let’s instead have less flights, less individual transport and more mass transit.
I think I generally agree to your idea but want to include future generations; sustainability. It’s not enough to allow all currently living people a certain lifestyle. What good is it if the result is a scorched Earth a few decades later?
Or maybe you didn’t mean it that way. Sorry then, still wanted to make that point.
Skewed analysis is skewed.
From their own source, 4% of the fuel consumption comes from private flights, so the 1% of people are mostly taking commercial flights (70% of gas consumption), the petition should be to ban private and the majority of passenger commercial flights.
Did you know that four passengers in a Suburban pollute less for the same amount of miles traveled than if they were going to their destination by plane? Don’t see many people thinking about that when taking the plane to visit the world, not even those who are eco anxious.
I stopped flying cross country a year ago. Not looking back. Thanks wife.
Funny how fake news don’t ever advocate this position, can’t do that, it would hurt better people. but eating bugs, turning down AC… “we are all in this together plebs”
How about you get your ass in the car and drive to work peasants, it’s good for the climate!
I’m not a European citizen, can I still sign this?
It is really nice to fly privately, though I understand why proplr don’t like them.
As someone who has taken a private flight provided through work, and rode on a fancy sleeper cabin on a train, trains are 1000x more enjoyable. It’s honestly really saddening we’ve let our rail system get this bad compared to other countries.
Difference: when 6ou fly a private jet, you can leave anytime you want to.
Rail is excellent for freight transport. There is no cheaper way to move a hell of a lot of heavy or bulky stuff across a continent, especially if what you’re transporting is not particularly time sensitive and can wait for you to acquire full loads before setting off.
Rail is absolutely terrible for passenger transport. All the advantages of freight rail are lost once you switch to passenger service.
The only place passenger rail works is in the densest of urban environments.
The worst possible case is allowing a passenger train - serving a couple hundred people - to take priority over and interfere with a freight train that serves tens of thousands of people.
Yeah I have no idea where this idea came from because it simply isn’t true in other countries if you are from the US.
Sure, modern rail starts falling short when you start doing long distances like from New York to Los Angeles.
However, for medium long distances, this is absolutely false.
Distance wise, a trip from Beijing to Shanghai is comparable to Chicago to New York or about 100 miles short compared to Dallas to Chicago.
Sure, a flight does that same distance in 2hrs 18minuties on average.
But compare that to the train cost only being $30 and showing up every 30 minutes as opposed to 4 times that amount for a plane ticket. If you miss that plane as well, then you’re SOL so you better show up to the airport two hours early according to the FAA!
No, I’m not some user from hex bear simping over China either. The sleeper car I was referring to was from Paris to Venice. Was like $70 for two. Departed at night, went to sleep, and woke up in the morning to keep enjoying my vacation. Sure, not as fast as the Chinese train, but this European train is also dated compared to that bullet train, plus there are way more mountains to traverse in this route. And it was absolutely lovely as opposed to playing $500 per ticket for a flight to the same destination.
A proper bullet train setup in the US, especially through the Midwest, not only would make travel cheaper, but you’d make rural towns more attractive to live in if a 2 -> 4 hour drive to the closest big city turns into a 30 minute train trip.
Private jet service for rich dog owners condemned by climate campaigners
Environmentalists have condemned a “ludicrous” private jet service that transports wealthy people’s dogs, which this week ran its first flight from Dubai to London.
For £8,166, one way, customers were able to sit with their dogs on their laps and sip champagne as they travelled from Al Maktoum international airport to Farnborough in a Gulfstream IV-SP jet.
The company, K9 Jets, which is run by a husband-and-wife couple from Birmingham, already operates services to New Jersey, Los Angeles, Frankfurt, Paris and Lisbon.
