Could the sweetened drinks we're consuming be making us feel a little more anxious? A 2022 study looking at the effects of the artificial sweetener aspartame on mice suggests that it's a possibility that's worth investigating further.
The implication here is that aspartame is often used in products that have these sugars present. Chances that aspartame is in a product without sugars is exorbitantly lower.
I want to be super clear if anyone finds this and thinks maybe…
No, there is no evidence of artificial sweeteners causing harm. There is no conspiracy, and after many many studies over decades, nothing has been found. If there had been, then the artificial sweeteners would have been banned like the ones you’ve never heard of because we all banned them for causing problems.
If you drink regular soda today, you should absolutely look at replacing that with a diet varient without sugar. From everything we have learned over decades, it’s absolutely safe.
A few people are replying with links (of various relevance) but you are just saying “no” and claiming you’re being “super clear”. Some of the replies are directly contraindications of the claim:
If you drink regular soda today, you should absolutely look at replacing that with a diet varient without sugar.
Your counterpoint is saying they are “absolutely safe”. I don’t know whether you are right or wrong. It’s not anywhere near my field, but I can say I don’t find your rhetoric convincing.
Edit: I fucked up and pasted the wrong quote. I changed the quote to the one I meant.
You do not need to find my rhetoric “convincing.” One person posted one link, the link was to a meta study that concludes that artificial sweeteners have no evidence that they cause harm.
I am being clear, I am not using confusing language, and I’m stating one thing, over and over. I’m doing this because other people are muddying the water with poor claims, and I do not want anyone reading this thread to come away with the idea that maybe the artificial sweeteners are bad. There is no evidence. Again, I’m being super clear. There is absolutely no evidence, and they are absolutely safe. There is no evidence that suggests they are not absolutely safe.
This place is full of nerds like you and me, and they like to be pandantic. I’m being clear, and using phrases like “absolutely safe” is the correct terminology when we know of no evidence to suggest otherwise.
Again, artificial sweeteners are as far as we know, and we have studied them a lot, absolutely safe and you should consider replacing your sugar intake with them or reducing your sugar intake entirely if you can. Sugar is a large cause of health problems.
My point is that you are just some voice on the internet. When I say I don’t find your rhetoric convincing, I mean that the only evidence you offer is rhetoric. And that is not convincing regardless of how clear you are speaking.
You’re using overly broad language. Multiple family members and myself get brutal headaches from aspartame. While that’s certainly not life threatening damage, it is fair to call that a harmful effect. I am not better off with many products switching to aspartame as a sweetener.
Yes, it is just an anecdote, but it’s enough to show that absolute statements don’t usually hold universally. Please stay open to the possibility of nuance.
Seemed fair to me, youre using strong words like “absolutely safe”, even though there are known reactions to various sweeteners and they arent “absolutely” safe, as per the link I cited above.
Eh, IIRC there’s research that if you eat incredible amounts it’ll likely be bad for you. But it’s a lot and the equivalent amount of sugar would be way way worse.
I can’t tell what this is supposed to convey. They asked for a study. You give a bare url to an abstract with the quote
there is no clear consensus on whether non-sugar sweeteners are effective for long-term weight loss or maintenance, or if they are linked to other long-term health effects at intakes within the ADI.
Are you agreeing with the post you are replying to?
They asked for a study. You give a bare url to an abstract with the quote
Perhaps you could download the entire meta study that is linked next to the abstract and go through it? And why does it matter whether I’m agreeing with the post?
From all the years of reading about artificial sugar studies, it’s clear to me that there could be a risk but it is complex and varies from person to person, I find it misplaced to shout that there is absolutely no risk involved. To quote the study:
Result of this review largely agree with those of other recent systematic reviews, in that replacing sugars with NSS in the short term results in reductions in body weight, with little impact on other cardiometabolic risk factors, but is associated with increased risk of type 2 diabetes,
cardiovascular diseases and mortality in the longer term.
Perhaps you could download the entire meta study that is linked next to the abstract and go through it?
No, I am not refereeing a paper because some commenter links it in a web forum. Why would you think that’s even close to what anyone should do in this environment?
So let me get this straight, someone asks for a study, I provide the study of studies, which you misjudge originally for being only an abstract, and then when I correct you and tell you it’s a study, suddenly it’s not good enough. What do you actually want?
I want conversation. Bare links are not that. Looking at the link led me to believe you providing evidence for the quack who was professing absolute safety.
Scientifically, I agree with you. I was asking the “absolute safety” commentor to provide context to studies to lead one to that conclusion. I would have been happy to read the same from you.
You have a lot to say for someone who is happy to slap a url down and move along. :)
Eh, IIRC there’s research that if you eat incredible amounts it’ll likely be bad for you. But it’s a lot and the equivalent amount of sugar would be way way worse.
there’s little research to show sugar dangers to be more than correlation
fat people eat a lot of sugar. fat people also eat a lot. eating a lot is how you get fat, drinking calories just happens to be a fast track to getting fat. diet soda happens to be physiologically like drinking water. fat people drink diet instead of sugar coke thats already 200-1000 calories of their day GONE with very very minimal change.
then those fat people supplement the lost sugars with more food and they gain weight. then you get studies showing GUYS DIET SODA CAUSES WEIGHT GAIN (in fat people)
but no its not the sugar its not the macros its YOU eating too much and you can eat less to lose weight that’s just simple science. body types, “nuance”, “bad metabolism”. none of that shits real it all stems from shitty dietary choices and lack of muscle.
all of this to say unless theres medical issues or medical intervention your weight and body type is 100% in your control should you choose to take control
Your lemon curd is full of thickener (egg yolk) and sugar (honey) too.
What thickener did they use? Soy lecithin? That’s the same thickener as found in your egg yolks.
What sugar? Just regular sugar? That has a similar glycemic index as honey.
Concentrated lemon juice is just lemon juice without the water. Was there also water in the recipe?
Sounds like your stomach trouble was due to something else. I’m not saying the lemon curd you bought was good quality, but it probably wasn’t much different than what you make. And those scary ingredients are the same as the ones that you already use.
those scary ingredients are the same as the ones that you already use.
lol. They used xanthan gum and white sugar.
Scary? Try this:
Honey is an antioxidant, antibacterial, antifungal, and anti-inflammatory that also lowers triglycerides,
and does not cause joint pain like white sugar does.
You are correct, the caveat “added sugar” or added sweetener in this case is the important bit.
Fructose doesn’t have the same health effects of sucrose for some reason and the sugar you eat in fruit and veg come with fiber which helps keep our blood sugar from spiking.
I was shocked to learn that dates, which are basically candy, have a pretty reasonable glycemic index.
Fructose doesn’t have the same health effects of sucrose for some reason
That’s because fructolysis has a slightly different pathway and fate as compared to glycolysis, which results in far lower efficiency of conversion. Meaning glucose gets converted into more calories than fructose does.
Probably people who are a bit sketch about the “even natural sugars” bit, since that removes a TON of otherwise healthy food options. Minimize added sugar, sure.
There’s nothing inherently bad about sugar. It’s just energy. If you intake more energy than you burn it’s getting stored for future use (you get fat). The same goes for almost anything “unhealthy”. Manage your energy intake and almost nothing is unhealthy.
Removing all forms of added sugar would probably make everyone feel better. Even minimizing natural sugar intake.
Sugar is terrible, there’s no doubt about it. Artificial or otherwise.
There’s no research that indicates the currently used artificial sweeteners are bad for you.
Theres mixed analysis over the decades, actually, and different groups have different conclusions.
https://www.everydayhealth.com/diet-nutrition/sweet-n-low-dangers-still-exist/
Overall, id say limiting added sugars (natural or artificial) is rpobably better for your health long term
Artificial sugars and sweeteners are, by and large, very different things. Aspartame isn’t a sugar of any sort.
The implication here is that aspartame is often used in products that have these sugars present. Chances that aspartame is in a product without sugars is exorbitantly lower.
I want to be super clear if anyone finds this and thinks maybe…
No, there is no evidence of artificial sweeteners causing harm. There is no conspiracy, and after many many studies over decades, nothing has been found. If there had been, then the artificial sweeteners would have been banned like the ones you’ve never heard of because we all banned them for causing problems.
If you drink regular soda today, you should absolutely look at replacing that with a diet varient without sugar. From everything we have learned over decades, it’s absolutely safe.
A few people are replying with links (of various relevance) but you are just saying “no” and claiming you’re being “super clear”. Some of the replies are directly contraindications of the claim:
Your counterpoint is saying they are “absolutely safe”. I don’t know whether you are right or wrong. It’s not anywhere near my field, but I can say I don’t find your rhetoric convincing.
Edit: I fucked up and pasted the wrong quote. I changed the quote to the one I meant.
You do not need to find my rhetoric “convincing.” One person posted one link, the link was to a meta study that concludes that artificial sweeteners have no evidence that they cause harm.
I am being clear, I am not using confusing language, and I’m stating one thing, over and over. I’m doing this because other people are muddying the water with poor claims, and I do not want anyone reading this thread to come away with the idea that maybe the artificial sweeteners are bad. There is no evidence. Again, I’m being super clear. There is absolutely no evidence, and they are absolutely safe. There is no evidence that suggests they are not absolutely safe.
This place is full of nerds like you and me, and they like to be pandantic. I’m being clear, and using phrases like “absolutely safe” is the correct terminology when we know of no evidence to suggest otherwise.
Again, artificial sweeteners are as far as we know, and we have studied them a lot, absolutely safe and you should consider replacing your sugar intake with them or reducing your sugar intake entirely if you can. Sugar is a large cause of health problems.
Who is we? Do you have a mouse in your pocket?
My point is that you are just some voice on the internet. When I say I don’t find your rhetoric convincing, I mean that the only evidence you offer is rhetoric. And that is not convincing regardless of how clear you are speaking.
You’re using overly broad language. Multiple family members and myself get brutal headaches from aspartame. While that’s certainly not life threatening damage, it is fair to call that a harmful effect. I am not better off with many products switching to aspartame as a sweetener.
Yes, it is just an anecdote, but it’s enough to show that absolute statements don’t usually hold universally. Please stay open to the possibility of nuance.
Where are the hydrohomies?
“Absolutely safe” sounds false. Pure water isnt “absolutely” safe after all
Please be overly pandantic somewhere else, it’s not useful here.
Seemed fair to me, youre using strong words like “absolutely safe”, even though there are known reactions to various sweeteners and they arent “absolutely” safe, as per the link I cited above.
Yes this is the overly pandantic part
Eh, IIRC there’s research that if you eat incredible amounts it’ll likely be bad for you. But it’s a lot and the equivalent amount of sugar would be way way worse.
Drinking too much water can kill you, too
i actually almost died from hyponatremia this year
https://www.who.int/publications/i/item/9789240046429
I can’t tell what this is supposed to convey. They asked for a study. You give a bare url to an abstract with the quote
Are you agreeing with the post you are replying to?
Perhaps you could download the entire meta study that is linked next to the abstract and go through it? And why does it matter whether I’m agreeing with the post?
From all the years of reading about artificial sugar studies, it’s clear to me that there could be a risk but it is complex and varies from person to person, I find it misplaced to shout that there is absolutely no risk involved. To quote the study:
No, I am not refereeing a paper because some commenter links it in a web forum. Why would you think that’s even close to what anyone should do in this environment?
So let me get this straight, someone asks for a study, I provide the study of studies, which you misjudge originally for being only an abstract, and then when I correct you and tell you it’s a study, suddenly it’s not good enough. What do you actually want?
I want conversation. Bare links are not that. Looking at the link led me to believe you providing evidence for the quack who was professing absolute safety.
Scientifically, I agree with you. I was asking the “absolute safety” commentor to provide context to studies to lead one to that conclusion. I would have been happy to read the same from you.
You have a lot to say for someone who is happy to slap a url down and move along. :)
Eh, IIRC there’s research that if you eat incredible amounts it’ll likely be bad for you. But it’s a lot and the equivalent amount of sugar would be way way worse.
there’s little research to show sugar dangers to be more than correlation
fat people eat a lot of sugar. fat people also eat a lot. eating a lot is how you get fat, drinking calories just happens to be a fast track to getting fat. diet soda happens to be physiologically like drinking water. fat people drink diet instead of sugar coke thats already 200-1000 calories of their day GONE with very very minimal change.
then those fat people supplement the lost sugars with more food and they gain weight. then you get studies showing GUYS DIET SODA CAUSES WEIGHT GAIN (in fat people)
but no its not the sugar its not the macros its YOU eating too much and you can eat less to lose weight that’s just simple science. body types, “nuance”, “bad metabolism”. none of that shits real it all stems from shitty dietary choices and lack of muscle.
all of this to say unless theres medical issues or medical intervention your weight and body type is 100% in your control should you choose to take control
How about all the research that shows sugar is addictive AF
Of course sugar is addictive as fuck - you would literally die without it.
I recently bought what was supposed to be lemon curd.
We made a bunch of mini tarts for xmas giveaways and I ate more than a few. For the next few days I ached like hell.
It turned out to be a pile of sugar and thickeners along with concentrated lemon juice.
The main ingredients in my lemon curd are lemon juice, lemon zest, egg yolks, and wildflower honey.
Your lemon curd is full of thickener (egg yolk) and sugar (honey) too.
What thickener did they use? Soy lecithin? That’s the same thickener as found in your egg yolks.
What sugar? Just regular sugar? That has a similar glycemic index as honey.
Concentrated lemon juice is just lemon juice without the water. Was there also water in the recipe?
Sounds like your stomach trouble was due to something else. I’m not saying the lemon curd you bought was good quality, but it probably wasn’t much different than what you make. And those scary ingredients are the same as the ones that you already use.
Probably the “more than a few” they ate.
Overconsumption leads to health issues? More at 9.
Scary? Try this:
Honey is an antioxidant, antibacterial, antifungal, and anti-inflammatory that also lowers triglycerides, and does not cause joint pain like white sugar does.
Absolutely nothing wrong with a diet high in fruit and veg, both of which contain significant amounts of sugar.
You are correct, the caveat “added sugar” or added sweetener in this case is the important bit.
Fructose doesn’t have the same health effects of sucrose for some reason and the sugar you eat in fruit and veg come with fiber which helps keep our blood sugar from spiking.
I was shocked to learn that dates, which are basically candy, have a pretty reasonable glycemic index.
Except that guy wrote:
Which precludes fruit and a good deal of veg.
That’s because fructolysis has a slightly different pathway and fate as compared to glycolysis, which results in far lower efficiency of conversion. Meaning glucose gets converted into more calories than fructose does.
Fruits make me just as sick as any other source of sugar. Fruit is just candy in a natural wrapper.
The biggest question in this thread, who would downvote this?
Probably people who are a bit sketch about the “even natural sugars” bit, since that removes a TON of otherwise healthy food options. Minimize added sugar, sure.
There’s nothing inherently bad about sugar. It’s just energy. If you intake more energy than you burn it’s getting stored for future use (you get fat). The same goes for almost anything “unhealthy”. Manage your energy intake and almost nothing is unhealthy.